Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that any time spent on quorum calls during this debate on the sexual assault issue be equally divided between Senator Gillibrand on one side and Senator Ayotte and Senator McCaskill on the other side.…
Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that any time spent on quorum calls during this debate on the sexual assault issue be equally divided between Senator Gillibrand on one side and Senator Ayotte and Senator McCaskill on the other side.
I yield 5 minutes of the time of Senator Ayotte to the Senator from Missouri, Mr. Blunt.
Mr. President, I thank Senator Blunt for his comments and appreciate his hard work on the Armed Services Committee as we tackle an issue that all of us have an emotional commitment to for all the right reasons.
I thank Senator Gillibrand. We both want fundamental reform. We are both working as hard as we know how to get it. We have a fundamental disagreement on how best to obtain that goal, and I would like to go through some of that disagreement for the next few minutes.
The 26 historic reforms that are in the bill are going to make our military the most victim-friendly criminal justice system in the world. In no other system does a victim get their own lawyer. In no other system will they have the protection, empowerment, and the deference we are creating for them in this bill.
In my years of experience in handling these cases--hundreds of them with victims--I would have given anything if that victim had had the confidence of independent advice. I think it would have made a tremendous difference in the staggering number of victims who refused to go forward.
This is the most personally painful moment of anyone's life. Make no mistake about it, no matter what we do in this Chamber and no matter what this bill accomplishes, we will never be able to get every victim to come forward because of the nature of this horrific crime, but we have to do better.
Like Senator Gillibrand, I have talked to dozens and dozens and dozens of victims. I have talked to and spent hundreds of hours with prosecutors--military prosecutors, women and men, veterans, commanders, active and retired--and just as there is not agreement among all the women in this Chamber, there is not agreement among all the victims, there is not agreement among all the veterans, there is not agreement even among all the commanders, although most women commanders have acknowledged that even though this sounds seductively simple, it is much more complicated, and we will be creating more problems than we will be solving if we make the change as advocated by Senator Gillibrand.
Let's get at what we are trying to do. We have no disagreement that there are too many of these crimes and that they are not reported enough--complete agreement. The goal here is how do we get more reporting. There is a theory that if we do this--if we take this decision away from any command at all to go forward, that that will magically have victims come forward.
Senator Gillibrand talked about our allies. I am grateful we have their experience because we can look and see what happened. Our allies have done this, and not in one instance has reporting gone up. We know this is not the silver bullet because if it were, we would have seen an increase in reporting in all the countries that have adopted this system.
The response systems panel was put in place by the Armed Services Committee to recommend to the Pentagon changes in this area. We know they have formally acknowledged that our allies--many of whom did this to protect defendants' rights--have not seen an increase in reporting.
If the theory is that reporting can only go up if we do this, then why are we seeing a spike in reporting right now? There is a 46-percent increase of reporting this year over last year. That is because some of the military are already putting in the reforms we are codifying in the underlying bill. They are giving victims their own lawyers. They are ramping up the protection, information, and deference they give victims. That is the single most important factor, based on all of my experience, that will dictate whether a victim has the courage to come out of the shadows, and finally that somehow doing this will stop retaliation. That unit is still going to know that that crime was reported.
Keep in mind that currently, and under our reforms, the victim does not have to report to the chain of command. Right now the victim does not have to report to the chain of command. Many of my colleagues didn't realize that a victim has many places they can report this crime. Under our reforms, they will immediately get a lawyer and have that level of protection immediately. They will also have the information that they don't have to report to the chain of command.
I am trying to understand how reporting, investigating, and deciding half a continent away--a group of lawyers making that decision--stops retaliation. How does that keep the people in your unit from acting inappropriately toward you because you have reported a crime? There is nothing magical about that. In most instances the word will get out.
Let's use our common sense. Say you are back in your unit after having been assaulted. Which way are you going to have more protection? Will you have more protection if a group of colonels a half continent away is looking at the facts of the case or if your commander has signed off? Of course, if your commander has signed off, because that sends a message to the unit: We are getting to the bottom of this.
Probably the most telling fact about this debate is: Is this happening now? Because at this time outside investigators investigate these cases, and outside JAGs make recommendations. We have that in our system now. So the question is: If these outside lawyers are recommending that we go forward based on their independent investigation, are commanders shutting them down? Are commanders saying: We will not go forward? No one can find me a case where that happened and the prosecutors said: We need to go and the commanders said no.
On the other hand, over the last 2 years, there have been 93 separate times the outside lawyer said: You know, this case is too weak, this case doesn't have enough facts--93 times. You know what happened in every one of those cases? The commander said: We are going to get to the bottom of it. So almost 100 victims over the last 2 years would not have had their day in court under Senator Gillibrand's proposal.
In Senator Gillibrand's proposal, when the lawyer says no, it is over, whereas, in our proposal, if this were to ever happen, even though we know this is not a problem now, we have review after review after review. No one is going to be able to turn a victim away from her day of justice without accountability, checks and balances, and oversight. There will be a difference in that unit because now retaliation is a crime and the commander is going to be evaluated on how they are handling this issue within their command.
There are also practical problems--and some of my colleagues will come to the floor today and talk about this. There are a number of implementation issues that I don't think have been thought through, and this is the real world here. We are talking about appeals and challenges. We are talking about not even having enough colonels right now to staff this. We are talking about risking the ability to get a speedy trial. We are talking about eliminating the ability to plea bargain.
Let me tell the Presiding Officer, having handled these cases, I think people sometimes make the assumption that a plea bargain is about copping out, it is about not protecting the victim. Talk about stories of victims, I can tell story after story of real people whom I dealt with who came forward and said: Yes, I think I can do this.
I will never forget this one woman who came to me and said: My mental health counselor said that testifying in court will set me back so far I can't do it, but can you get something on him? In those instances, do you think that defense lawyer is going to plead to a sexual offense or even a serious offense? But many times we were able to get something on him so the next time, if it happened, we at least had a better shot. Many times plea bargains are dictated by victims. Military prosecutors are telling me this, that it will really limit their ability and create serious due process concern.
In her proposal, this outside lawyer picks everybody--picks the defense lawyer, picks the jury, and picks the prosecutor. How is that going to stand up to a due process claim? It is not clear who picks the judge. That is left silent. I don't know who picks the judge. It is not clear. That is another question: Who is going to decide who is going to actually pick the judge?
It eliminates the option of nonjudicial punishment. Take the case of the Air Force airman who was just recently tried in civilian courts. He was initially charged with a sexual offense. It was reduced to a simple assault. If that had been within the military, they couldn't have done that because it wasn't a serious offense so it goes back over to the convening authority within the command and then that soldier knows they are not going to do a trial--they can't--and all he has to do is turn down nonjudicial punishment.
Some of these difficulties will be explored in more detail, as I say, throughout the day.
Here is the one I don't understand. If a person believes deeply in the policy he or she is advocating, why in the world would that person then proactively limit the ability to resource it? In the language of the Gillibrand amendment, it actually says there shall be no funds authorized for this, no personnel billets authorized for this. The military has estimated over $100 million a year just in personnel costs because they have to create a completely different system outside the system they currently have, which will still be operative for some offenses that are related to the military and that are low-level offenses. But we have to have a whole new system for arson, robbery, theft, murder, and for sexual assault. Yet she proactively in her amendment says we can't resource it. That is truly one that makes me scratch my head.
There are a lot of problems surrounding this amendment, but let me emphasize our goals are the same and our motives are pure. We believe-- and we believe this is borne out by the data--we will have more prosecutions because it will be very easy for lawyers who are a long way away--overworked, underresourced--to say: This is a consent case. It is a little messy. Everybody was drunk. Let that one go, and then it is over.
Let me briefly talk about what we have in our amendment because it is also very important, once again empowering victims further. In our amendment we are going to allow victims to formally weigh in, whether they would prefer, if there is concurrent jurisdiction, for the civilian authorities to handle the case in addition or whether they would rather the military authorities handle the case. It strengthens the role of the prosecutor because it provides another layer of review over the prosecutor's decisions. It increases the accountability of commanders making this evaluation on their forms and adding that other layer of review. It eliminates the good soldier defense. It is irrelevant whether someone is a good pilot if they have sodomized or raped someone in the military, and our amendment will make it irrelevant and inadmissible.
I thank the Presiding Officer for the time. I know we have others who want to visit on this, and I will be happy to be back later in the day to talk specifically about some of the other issues in this bill.
I do not see anyone else here right now, so I suggest the absence of a quorum.
Would the Senator yield for a question?
I want to make sure I understand something about nontraditional punishment. Since the Senator is discussing the barracks thief in Afghanistan and the notion that everything is going to stop and this case is going to be sent off to a lawyer half a continent away to make a decision, let's assume the lawyer--the colonel in Washington--decides there is insufficient evidence for that barracks thief. That might be 4 months later. Meanwhile, the barracks thief is still there. And let's assume it then comes back. It is my understanding--and I think there is some confusion about this by the people who are advocating this amendment--that you cannot exercise nonjudicial punishment on a soldier if he chooses a court-martial proceeding. Is that correct?
So that commander who has to now send----
That case to Washington--that soldier is not going to agree to nonjudicial punishment. He is going to say: I will take my chances with the lawyers in Washington. And if the lawyers in Washington say no, then that commander's hands are completely tied to even putting him in the brig for 30 days.