Mr. President, as I understand it, there is no time agreement on the second-degree amendment; is that correct? Nor do I think there will be. I realize the second-degree amendment is designed--whether intentionally or otherwise--to protect…
Mr. President, as I understand it, there is no time agreement on the second-degree amendment; is that correct?
Nor do I think there will be. I realize the second-degree amendment is designed--whether intentionally or otherwise--to protect a number of the major corporations now working in Iraq, some of which have been involved with overcharging our military and profiting on the war. It is unfortunate that we would try to protect those who are gouging the American taxpayers.
After World War II and after the Korean War, we put in a war profiteering amendment similar to what I offered, and I would say to my distinguished friend from Virginia, we passed a similar war profiteering amendment on the Iraq supplemental appropriations bill last year. But when it came up in conference with the other body, even though they are independent Members of the House, several of them were very candid and told me they had been directed by the White House to remove it and had heavy pressure brought by Halliburton and others. So they had to remove the war profiteering amendment.
I actually thought we were elected not by corporations, whether it is Halliburton or anybody else, and not appointed by the White House, but, rather, are here to do the American people's business.
Now, be that as it may, I would hope that at some point we would get to the underlying amendment, and it would actually be the law today except that the White House and Halliburton and others told the Republican majority, the leadership in the other body, that they had to take it out, which they did.
I commend the majority of Senators, both Republicans and Democrats, who supported it originally and have been willing to resist the pressure of the White House.
Over the last few weeks, the news has been dominated by events in Iraq. We are still trying to figure out exactly what went wrong in Abu Ghraib prison as well as other detention centers around the world. There has been some disagreement on this issue, but I think we have already learned a couple of lessons.
We need to improve transparency. We need to improve accountability. We need to put in place strong measures to prevent illegal and immoral acts. The reason for doing this is simple. Bad behavior by a few can lower morale among American soldiers. It can undermine support at home for the mission, and it could damage the work of the vast majority of brave men and women who are trying to do the right thing, trying to make life better, and are putting themselves in harm's way every day. By all means, we ought to take action in this body to make sure that no corporation or group can come in and make obscene profits or engage in war profiteering while our American men and women are putting their lives on the line for their country. We should not have anybody come in and say: Here is a great way to make some huge profit off their suffering and off the suffering of the Iraqi people.
So my amendment does not have anything to do with the recent prison abuses in Iraq, but it does address the serious issues I mentioned. It addresses the serious and sinister problem of war profiteering that can harm our mission there and around the world.
Senator Harry Truman served with distinction in this body and conducted Senate committee investigations into war profiteering during World War II. Then-Senator Truman, later President, said on this issue:
No one objects to a fair profit . . . [I]t is our duty . .
. to protect the patriotic majority of war contractors
against a stigma of profiteering generated by the self
seeking minority. We intend to see that no man or corporate
group of men shall profit inordinately on the blood of the
boys in the fox holes.
Today we have both men and women on the frontlines. And we have a lot of companies over there who are putting their own people in harm's way. They are doing it with the best interests of our country and the best interests of the Iraqi people. They are doing it very bravely. They are not doing it to profit from the war. As Harry Truman said: We have to take care; we have ``to protect the patriotic majority of war contractors against the stigma of profiteering generated by the self seeking minority.''
All my amendment says is that while most of the people over there will be playing by the rules, for those who are not, we are going to hold you accountable.
As a former prosecutor, I know nothing focuses the minds of those who are committing crimes more than knowing somebody can put them in prison for a long time. I will give you an easy example. If you have five warehouses lined up and four of them have heavy locks on the doors and one doesn't, that is the one that usually gets burgled. In this case, most people are going to be very honest. But without the locks on the doors, there are going to be some who try to get away with ripping off the American taxpayers.
I would hope that everybody in this body, Republican and Democrat, would agree with what President Truman said. I am concerned because we have seen one bad headline after another--the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post, the New York Times, and others--about Government contracts in Iraq.
In addition, Time magazine recently reported on an e-mail sent by a Pentagon official that raises serious questions involving Vice President Cheney's office, the White House, and the Vice President's former employer, Halliburton. This is what the e-mail says: A multibillion-dollar Halliburton contract was approved ``contingent on informing White House tomorrow. We anticipate no issue since action has been coordinated with Vice President's office.''
And right on schedule, 3 days later, the Army Corps of Engineers gave Halliburton a multibillion-dollar contract, and they did it without seeking any other bids. This does not look like a typical heads-up memo, as the Vice President's office is now claiming. To this former prosecutor from Vermont, it looks like a coordinated scheme to enrich Halliburton at taxpayer expense with no-bid contracts.
This latest revelation underscores the need to address this issue. Even if there is a reasonable explanation for this outrageous e-mail-- and I am still waiting to hear what it is--we have to put in place tough measures to address this issue. I think we have to send a clear message that lining one's pockets, especially while our troops are in harm's way, is simply unacceptable.
I hope my amendment, if we are allowed to vote on it, will put a stop to these scandals. This amendment should pass unanimously. I am sorry that the Republican leadership has decided to put what I could only call ``a hold Halliburton harmless'' second-degree amendment in here. I hope that those majority of Senators, Republicans and Democrats alike, who voted for this amendment last year will vote against the second- degree amendment and vote for this amendment. Vote against the ``hold Halliburton harmless'' amendment and vote for the war profiteering prevention amendment.
The war profiteering prevention amendment, if it becomes part of law, will send a very clear signal. I don't care what the corporation is, whether the corporation is from Vermont or anywhere else, it will send a very clear signal: Play by the rules. But if you don't play by the rules, just as Harry Truman said after World War II, we are going to hold you accountable.
Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent, at the request of the distinguished chairman, that we be allowed to go into a quorum call until the hour of 2 p.m.; that then, by consent, the call of the quorum be rescinded and the Senator from Vermont be recognized again.
Mr. President, under the unanimous consent request, I suggest the absence of a quorum.
Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that the order for the quorum call be dispensed with.
Mr. President, I appreciate the concern of the distinguished senior Senator from Virginia in trying to find a way through this.
I want to make it very clear about what we have. The war profiteering bills President Truman spoke of after World War II were civil bills. This is a criminal statute. Actually, the criminal statute is more protective of the contractors because it requires a higher level of proof. As a former prosecutor, I much prefer the idea that someone thinks they are not just going to pay a fine, they might face prison.
Second, this passed in almost exactly this form in the supplemental appropriations bill. It was debated and passed as a separate measure in the committee. The amendment then became part of the Supplemental which passed the Senate by a wide margin. The amendment we are considering today is different only in two respects. This one applies to all countries; at that time, it applied only to Iraq. Second, the amendment the Senate passed earlier contained a sunset. The amendment here today does not.
When we went to conference, the House did not have a similar piece of legislation. The distinguished chairman of the Appropriations Committee, Senator Stevens, proposed they accept ours. They had a rollcall vote and, by party line, refused it. Senator Stevens had modified it with, I believe, a 7-year sunset. That was not accepted.
Several Republicans were very forthright in saying they were under pressure from the White House not to accept it. Some suggested they were under pressure from corporations that were major contributors. I suggested if there is a bad case of war profiteering, they may come back to regret it.
Senator Stevens very correctly wanted to make it clear that all Republicans and all Democrats on the Appropriations Committee, in the committee of conference, had supported this. It had been part of a bill we passed overwhelmingly, if not unanimously, in this body early. Because the House would not accept it, it was dropped.
Obviously, every Senator has to vote the way he or she wants, but as war profiteering goes on, it is something each Senator has to answer to his or her constituents.
I yield, without losing my right to the floor.
Mr. President, if I might retain my right to the floor, the senior Senator from Illinois is absolutely correct; I did. I offered it. We had a debate within the Appropriations Committee to accept it within the Appropriations Committee and it became part of the bill.
My earlier statement may have left confusion, and I apologize. There was no intention of doing that. It was part of the appropriations bill and thus not voted on by the Senate although there was not a single amendment to strike that provision. There were various amendments, as the Senator may recall, that were proposed during the appropriations bill on the Senate floor, but no one moved to strike this. It passed 93-0. About the only difference in that bill, as I recall, was the amendment spoke only to Iraq. This includes other countries besides Iraq.
Yes, we voted on it, we passed it, and then the Senate offered it as their position. Both Republicans and Democrats offered it as our position to the other body, which rejected it on a party-line vote at the request of the White House.
Mr. President, if I might, the Harry Truman proposal, course, was civil. This is a criminal law.
If the Senator would let me finish.
The Harry Truman amendment was civil. This is criminal. Thus, this is more protective of a defendant because, as the distinguished Senators know, and certainly those who have been prosecutors know all too well, in a criminal case you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. A civil case can often be the preponderance of the evidence. This is more protective of both sides. But it holds the hammer of a criminal proposal. This has tough criminal penalties for individuals who defraud the American taxpayer. It provides a maximum criminal penalty of 20 years in prison and fines of up to $1 million.
The reason we did criminal rather than civil, there was a time when if you proposed a $10 million fine back at the time of Harry Truman, that was a lot of money. We have had at least one company that has already had to pay back money on overcharging and profiteering. They spend more than that $10 million on a weekend running ads saying how good they are at feeding the troops. But if you are facing a criminal penalty and might go to the slammer, then you think about it.
I will state why this is necessary. For example, if we wanted to use current law, which is basically what the second-degree amendment is, current law does not specifically outlaw war profiteering. My amendment, which the Senator from Illinois has spoken about, does specifically outlaw war profiteering. We wanted to go as a second- degree amendment. Current statute does not say that U.S. courts have explicit and uncategorical jurisdiction over fraud and profiteering in Iraq. My amendment does. If we tried to just take current law, where are we? My amendment eliminates unnecessary thresholds, for example, to prove mail and wire fraud, and the current statutes do not. And, of course, a 20-year felony.
There really are no laws on the books that address war profiteering. There are laws on the books for murder, laws on the books for rape, laws on the books for armed robbery, but there is nothing that goes specifically into war profiteering. Frankly, what I want to do is not just to throw people in the slammer; I want to stop them from doing it in the first place.
This is a real deterrent. If you have a prosecution that says you can go to jail, not just pay a fine, which is small change for some of these companies, but you might actually go to jail, somebody is going to say: Wait a minute. We can't triple charge for this. We can't triple charge for these hotels. We can't triple charge for these cars--and so on.
Yes, without losing my right to the floor.
Mr. President, the Senator from Illinois raises the exact right point. You read these accounts in the press. I referred to the e- mail traffic which has just come out about a multibillion-dollar noncompetitive contract given to Halliburton after they had sent e- mails saying it was being cleared by the Vice President's office or it was OK with the Vice President's office, and there are the things you have talked about, the obvious things about war profiteering.
Now, had the other body left the amendment in, the amendment that was part of the appropriations bill that we passed overwhelmingly--I think 87 to 12 here in the Senate--had they left that in the final bill, had they stood up to the White House and not allowed them to convince them to strip it out, then the kinds of actions the Senator from Illinois is talking about would be prosecutable.
I would suggest they probably never would have happened. The taxpayers would have saved those millions upon millions of dollars because somebody would have told them back at corporate headquarters: Hey, guys, you can go to jail if you do this. It is not just the case that if you get caught, you might have to pay the money back, but you can go to jail if you do this. And that would stop it.
Now, if we pass this today, it still has to be signed into law, and it would be prospective. Unfortunately, because the other body basically gave in to the importunings of the White House and took out the amendment, the war profiteering amendment which had been part of the bill that every one of us on this floor voted for, we cannot do anything about that. Had that been put into law, as it should have been, I suspect the activities that the Senator from Illinois has talked about would not have occurred because whoever is on the ground is going to call back and say: Hey, guys, it might sound good to you back home there, but I am not going to go to jail. I am not going to go to jail just to raise a little more money. I am not going to go to jail just because you say if you get caught you may have to pay it back, and it wouldn't happen.
What I am saying is this: When companies, especially some companies that have been accused of this, will spend more money in a few days here in Washington running ads to convince 535 Members of Congress how wonderful they are than they could possibly pay in fines, they do not care. You could leave whatever laws are on the books now. You could leave the possibility of paying it back. Because what happens? If you are a company and you go ahead and profiteer, you do war profiteering, you overcharge, you do whatever these other things are, and you do it 10 times, and you get caught 3 times, and they say: You are going to pay back those millions you overcharged--you say: Gosh, almighty, you got me. Gee, I'm sorry. Gee whiz. Here it is. And you tell your bookkeepers: They didn't find the other 7. We are ahead of the game.
On the other hand, if you do it 10 times, and you get caught on 3 of them, and suddenly people start going to jail, these other companies are going to say: Wait a minute, no-bid contracts or not, I am not going to take the chance.
If we want to stand up for the American taxpayers, if we want to say we are tough on crime, let's say criminals go to jail. That is all there is. Let's try this law. Let's see. Maybe if this is on the books people will stop profiteering.
What drives me up the wall is we have 140,000 very brave men and women--American men and women--over there under arms who are trying to do their best and getting shot at every day. I was at a funeral in Vermont this week for one of them, as I have been on several other occasions. They are putting their lives on the line. They are getting paid what a corporal or a sergeant gets paid, and they should not have to be putting up with companies back here making obscene profits on what they do. They put their lives on the line.
What I am saying is, some of the people who are making these obscene profits, they ought to at least go to jail. They ought to at least go to jail. I was thinking of that this week when I was at that funeral in Vermont. These are brave American men and women. I know every one of us here applauds their bravery. But I do not want to see companies, whether they are American companies or any other companies, making money on our sons and daughters who are over there putting their lives on the line.
That is why I want this amendment. That is why we should have kept it in the bill before. Frankly, we ought to keep it in now. Now, I fully understand that the White House comes out here and says: We don't want to tamper with these people. We don't want to put the brakes on them. They can get the votes to knock down this amendment, but it is wrong. It is wrong. And I suggest that some of those who lobby against this kind of amendment go to some of these funerals--go to some of these funerals--and tell them we will protect the people who are profiteering. It is wrong. It is wrong. We ought to be protecting them.
Mr. President, I yield without losing my right to the floor, of course.
Mr. President, regaining my right to the floor, of course I am willing to offer the appropriate courtesy, very soon, to the Senator from Virginia. He is one of the most distinguished Members of this body, and, more importantly, he and I have been close friends for over a quarter of a century.
I say to the Senator, I wonder if you might consider this: have a vote on your amendment, and have a vote on my amendment separately, and let the Senate work its will. The distinguished senior Senator from Virginia is going to be the Senate chairman in the committee of conference. It gives him that much more control. But why not let the U.S. Senate vote on each amendment separately and then see where it goes from there?
I will say this very frankly. I think the reason nobody moved to strike my amendment out of the appropriations bill was that--I heard this from both sides--they said: OK, we understand this is not a bad amendment, and we don't want to be on record as saying we are against it.
I think the reason both Republicans and Democrats in the Senate urged it upon the other body was for them. I think the obvious embarrassment by some, not all, but the obvious embarrassment by some who had to vote against it on the other side was they wished they had not. They wished they could have kept it in. So I would ask my dear friend from Virginia--and he is truly my dear friend--what do you think of that idea? Let's vote on both of them?
Mr. President, certainly, if the distinguished Senator from Virginia wishes to speak, I am not going to withhold the floor from him. He has accommodated me when I have wanted to speak. I yield the floor.
If I might respond to that, they have. The Senator from Virginia asked whether they have done it in a criminal prosecution. No, this is not a criminal statute. They have done it in a civil case, and there is a huge amount of case law on this in civil cases. The only difference is, if the Senator is worried about the rights of contractors and others, in a criminal case, of course, you have to prove specific intent. In civil cases, you have to prove it with a preponderance of the evidence. Here you have to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. But these are words of art: ``overvalues a good or service with specific intent to excessively profit from the war, military action. . . .'' Those are words of art. They have been interpreted by the courts.
The difference, again, as I said, if you are doing it in a criminal case, as the Senator from Virginia well knows, you have to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.
``Excessively profit'' is taken from the renegotiation act, which is, as I said, a civil act. The constitutionality of that was upheld; I believe it was in the Lichter case.
It has to be beyond a reasonable doubt. And I have prosecuted thousands of cases, tried hundreds of them as a prosecutor. I know that is one high hurdle.
Will the Senator yield for a question?
My question to the distinguished senior Senator from Virginia probably reflects my confusion. He was concerned about the 20- year penalty to which this might subject some of these contractors. Obviously, thousands of contractors are not going to be subjected to that. It is only going to be the most grievous ones.
He is proposing, if I am correct, a statute that would subject overseas contractors to a 30-year penalty. I thought I was a tough prosecutor. The Senator from Virginia complains about my 20-year penalty; he is proposing 30 years. I don't mean to get into a bidding war on penalties, but if my 20 years is too Draconian, 30 years sounds even more so.
Mr. President, if I may respond without the Senator losing his right to the floor, he is relying on a statute--if I recall, without hearings; there was an amendment to the Sarbanes-Oxley bill a couple years ago on the floor. If we are talking about criminal statutes and changing them by whim, that is one that said no more debate on this. I am bringing up something that was debated rather thoroughly in the Appropriations Committee, including a bill the Senator from Virginia and I voted for last year.
It was debated, of course, in committee. It was well noted here before all Senators. Nobody, either Republican or Democrat, made the normal motion to strike that was done when you have a part to which you object. The Senator from Virginia is right that this is slightly different. That one was just for Iraq. This includes Afghanistan and elsewhere and does not contain a sunset provision.
I must admit that we are somewhat inclined to do that, especially after hearing of these e-mails that have just been made public. We are not talking about somebody who shows up and provides five dozen baseball caps to one of our military groups somewhere around the world. We are talking about people getting a billion dollars, with no-bid, no- competition contracts. I think we ought to at least be able to look at them and make sure they are spending our money correctly.
Mr. President, I am confused by the response. Is the Senator saying that section 1001 of title 18 was not amended by the Sarbanes-Oxley Act about a year and a half ago?
Whatever it was----
It was not increased back in--if the Senator tells me the Sarbanes-Oxley Act was not amended on section 1001 at all, I will accept that.
Mr. President, is it the position of my friend from Virginia that the kinds of things we have heard about--and he sees it more than I do as chairman of the Armed Services Committee--about the hundreds of millions of dollars being overcharged in meals, and hundreds of millions of dollars being overcharged on vehicles, housing, and construction. Any of those would be covered by his statute.
Mr. President, if I might, obviously the statutes on the books have not stopped them from overcharging, have not stopped them from the kinds of things we have seen.
Nobody wants to use the word ``Halliburton'' around here, but we constantly pick up the paper and read about a number of these companies. They are obviously overcharging, and nothing is happening to them. I am just one frustrated American who wants them to stop.
Mr. President, will the Senator yield for another question?
Let me ask the Senator from Virginia this: Suppose we have an item, and one of these contractors about which we are talking charges $2,000 for an item. It cost him $5. We remember back to the days of the $500 hammer. He charges the Government $2,000 for an item that costs $5, but he does not lie about this. He does not conceal the cost. He simply says: Here is my bill.
He says: OK, it is $2,000. He paid $5. He does not conceal that cost. He does not lie. He just says: Here is the bill for $2,000. He has not lied. He did not conceal--the bill is not hidden somewhere else. It is a straight-out bill, but he is obviously gouging the Government, charging $2,000 for a $5 item. Does the Senator's statute cover that situation?
That is not a scheme. He said: I just delivered this widget. Here is your bill for $2,000. And there are so many other things going on, the Government says: Here is your 2,000 bucks. It is not a scheme. It is not an artifice. He is not hiding the fact at all. He said: Here is your bill for $2,000 and somewhere gets paid in the bureaucracy. He has obviously gouged. He has not lied about it. He is up front about it. Does the Senator's statute cover that because that happens a lot?
Mr. President, is the Senator from Virginia saying, then, it would require fraud?
We are getting a lot of no-bid contracts with basically the company, as we found in these e-mails, saying: Here is what it is going to be.
There are no bids. There is nothing else. The Government says: OK, go forward. But there is no question there has been war profiteering there. There has been no fraud, no artifice, nothing else. He just sent the bill, and the bill gets paid. It is profiteering, but I do not see where your statute covers that situation.
Mr. President, if I may respond, they realize there are not going to be bids on this contract. They realize it is going to be OK'd as soon as they send it in. They have not done any tricks at all. They just say: Here is our bill. There is nobody else bidding, and it gets passed.
Some may say that may be fraud; that may not be. Mine does not say maybe. It just says to do it is a crime.
Mr. President, if I might respond to that, it is not a brandnew dimension. It is basically what we had in the Appropriations bill last year.
Secondly, it is completely appropriate to apply this new law to Iraq when we see these huge cost overruns on no-bid contracts, and nobody seems to be held accountable. Defense offered by lawyers for the contractor might be that there are no false statements and, therefore, no crime, even though one is ripping off the taxpayers.
It is similar to the guy who comes in and says: I will sell you this hammer for $2,000. He is not claiming it is a $2,000 hammer. He is not claiming he paid more than $5 for it. He says: I will sell it for $2,000. Has he made excess profit? Of course, he has. But when it comes to the point when our men and women are putting their lives on the line while others sit back in the boardrooms in America, I think every single lawyer in these boardrooms is going to know exactly what this amendment does, and it will be a strong deterrent.
Mr. President, as the White House proved last year when this amendment was debated during the Iraq supplemental conference, I am sure the Senator can pull up the votes to defeat me. I think it is a mistake. Frankly, I will keep on trying to bring up commonsense amendments to prevent war profiteering. Maybe sooner or later some of these people in the same boardrooms who are involved, who are getting no-bid contracts, may think: Maybe we better slow up because maybe one day the Senate will actually say we are going to hold you accountable if you engage in this sort of activity.
I asked unanimous consent--I have discussed this with the senior Senator from Virginia--that we have 2 minutes equally divided on the next amendment.
Two minutes is fine with me.
Madam President, I do not want to start until the Senate is in order.
Madam President, I voted, as did others, for the Warner amendment even though I see it as only the tiniest step toward addressing what we read about in the paper every single day, and that is war profiteering in Iraq. His amendment does not cover war profiteering; mine does. In fact, his, I believe, removes my prohibition against war profiteering. What I have in here is an amendment, very similar to what we passed in the appropriations bill earlier, about real war profiteering.
This Monday I was at the funeral in Vermont of a young sergeant who was killed in Iraq, just as my wife and I have been at other funerals of Vermonters killed over there, and I suspect most Members of the Senate have. They are over there defending their country. They are over there doing what their country asked them to, being paid as corporals and sergeants, and dying.
We have a lot of other people sitting in boardrooms back here in America, watching enormous profits, watching the American taxpayers pay for things that are never delivered, for trucks that are never there, for meals that are never there, and we can't stop them. My amendment would stop them. My amendment would put, if not patriotism in them, it will put the fear of going to jail in them.
Let us stand up for our American men and women over there. Let us stop the war profiteers. Let us say no to them, and let us say, if you continue, you are going to go to jail because that is where you belong.
Madam President, my amendment very simply says to the Halliburtons all over the country that you can't profit on the backs of our men and women in Iraq or Afghanistan. We all know that is what it is.
Madam President, I ask for the yeas and nays.
Mr. President, this afternoon, while debating my amendment on war profiteering, we became mired in a debate about what is or what is not in the criminal code.
I will not revisit that issue now. However, I will say to the senior Senator from Virginia, who asked from where the language in my amendment originated in the criminal code, that I have more information on that issue that should be to his satisfaction.
First, the term ``material'' appears in terrorism laws prohibiting ``material'' support. In fact, all falsity in the criminal code must ``material''. Pursuant to a Supreme Court ruling, part of proving a false statement must be ``material.''
Second, the term ``overvaluation'' is in Title 15 prohibiting ``criminally overvaluation'' of securities.
Third, with respect to ``intent to excessively profit,'' this is taken, in part, from ``significantly profit'' in 12 U.S.C. 1297 which criminalizes bank crimes. ``Significantly profit'' is, in fact, a lower standard that ``excessively profit.'' We erred on the side of caution and raised the standard.
Although I made this point clear during the debate, this should leave no doubt that my amendment is carefully constructed legislation.