Mr. President, I was going to talk about aircraft and aircraft procurement, and I will do that. But before I do that, I feel compelled to respond to the comments of our colleague from Arizona with respect to health care. It turns out,…
Mr. President, I was going to talk about aircraft and aircraft procurement, and I will do that. But before I do that, I feel compelled to respond to the comments of our colleague from Arizona with respect to health care.
It turns out, literally, as we gather here on the Senate floor today, negotiations are underway between Democrats and Republicans, led by Senator Max Baucus, the chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, and Senator Chuck Grassley, the ranking Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, to try to find common ground with respect to health care.
In a day and age when we spend more money on health care than any other nation on Earth, we do not get better results. I think we have 14,000 people who are likely to lose their health care in our country today--in a country where we have 47 million folks who do not have health care coverage. We can do better than that. There is a strong bipartisan effort, led by two very good people--Senator Grassley and Senator Baucus--to find common ground.
As it turns out, I like to use the words of a friend of mine, Senator Mike Enzi of Wyoming, who talks a lot about the 80-20 rule and why he and Senator Kennedy have gotten so much accomplished--legislation coming out of the Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions Committee. It is because they agree on 80 percent of the stuff, disagree on 20 percent of the stuff, and they focus on the 80 percent on which they agree.
I think the same could be said about the legislation that is being negotiated today, again, in a bipartisan way. The President has said he wants a bipartisan bill. Our leaders on the Finance Committee want a bipartisan bill. I want a bipartisan bill. I think in order for us to actually get something good, something done that improves the quality of health care that is provided in this country, that slows the growth of health care costs, and bends that cost curve down, and makes it possible for us to extend coverage to a lot of people who do not have it, it is enhanced by having bipartisan legislation.
I will not go further into that at this time. But I felt compelled to say I have not given up hope. My hope is that the efforts that are underway as I speak will bear fruit and maybe provide a roadmap to a plan we can agree to here in the Senate and in the House to build on the good work the Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions Committee has already done here in the Senate, and to enable us to find common ground with the House and, hopefully, with the Obama administration.
Having said that--I know this might be a good segue--we are spending a ton of money on health care in this country. If you look at the size of our budget deficits, if you look at how much we spend in the country for health care--I am told it is about one-sixth of GDP--that is not sustainable. Medicare is likely to run out of money in about 7 years from now. That is not acceptable. We end up, meanwhile, not getting necessarily better results, and a lot of other countries are spending substantially less.
We have great models for health care delivery in this country. I will mention a few of them that are showing the way to provide better outcomes at less money. They include the Mayo in Minnesota and in Florida; an outfit called Geisinger in Hershey, PA; Intermountain Health in Utah, Kaiser Permanente in northern California; a cooperative called Puget Sound in Washington State; Cleveland Clinic in Cleveland, OH. There are a number of them. For the most part, they are nonprofits or cooperatives that have shown it is possible to provide better care, better outcomes, for less money than what we are getting in this fee- for-service operation that we now call a health care delivery system.
We can do better. My hope is we will keep working at it and not give up and that we will continue to try to work across the aisle until we come up with a product we can bring to the floor and negotiate, debate it on the floor, and then go to conference with the House.
In terms of things that we spend a lot of money on--not just health care--we spend a lot of money on the defense of our country. That is a major priority for our Nation. If we go back to 1990s, 1980s, 1970s, we went for a long time without balancing our budgets. In fact, it was not until, I think, fiscal year 1999, under the Clinton administration, that we actually balanced our budget for the first time, I think, since 1968. It was roughly 30 years, three decades that we went without balancing the budget. I think we did it again in 2000, and then when we had the handover from President Clinton to President Bush, we left the new President with a budget that was, I believe, balanced once more.
We sort of went from that point in time, kind of a high-water mark in terms of fiscal responsibility, and over the last 8 years we turned around and we went in the opposite direction. We ended up running up more new debt in the last 8 years than we ran up in our first 208 years as a nation. I will say that again. We ran up more new debt in the last 8 years than we did in the first 208 as a nation. The debt for the new fiscal year, as we go through this worst recession since the Great Depression and trying to fight two wars, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan, the meltdown in revenues, very high health care costs; we are looking at a budget deficit which, I am told for this year, may have already exceeded $1 trillion, which is the highest on record.
I chair a subcommittee of the Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee in the Senate. One of our responsibilities is to help, along with our colleagues, to scrub spending. One of the things we do is we look for spending that doesn't make much sense or where there is waste, fraud or abuse. I might say, in response to my friend, Senator McCain's comments on waste in the Medicare system, one of the encouraging things in the last 3 years is we have gone out and done what we call postaudit cost recoveries in three States for Medicare. In California, Texas, and Florida, we have actually gone out to see where money has been wastefully spent and to see if we can recover that money. The first year we discovered almost nothing, the second year we found a little bit, and last year we found $700 million. In just three States we did that, and now we are going to be doing the same kind of thing in 47 States, hopefully recovering a lot more money for the Medicare system and maybe taking our lessons learned from recovering moneys misspent, inappropriately spent for Medicare, and do the same kind of thing for Medicaid, and that will put a lot of money back into the Treasury.
My subcommittee focuses on, among other things, wasteful spending, and one of the things we have looked at is cost overruns for major new weapons systems. With the help of the Government Accountability Office, we went back to, I think it was 2001, and we looked for cost overruns for major new weapons systems. In 2001, I think it was about $45 billion. We have seen it ramp up from about $45 billion in cost overruns for major new weapons systems, GAO tells us by last year, or maybe it was 2007 or 2008, this number had grown to almost $300 billion--from $245 billion in 2001 over the next 6 or 7 years to almost $300 billion in cost overruns.
Unacceptable. I think we have finally leveled off the increase. Not only is that kind of trend unacceptable, but the level of that enormous cost overrun in weapons systems is unacceptable as well.
In a day and age when our Nation is awash in red ink and in a day and age when we are involved in wars in Iraq and in Afghanistan, it is critically important that we spend every dollar--defense dollar and, frankly, nondefense dollars--as wisely as we can, to get the most out of that money, whether it is health care to make sure that the dollars we are investing there are spent cost-effectively or whether it is for defense to make sure that the money we are spending there is spent cost-effectively.
Senator McCain is a Vietnam veteran, and he is a real hero, for me. But we have people who have served here--I think one or two might have been around in World War II. Senator Inouye won the Medal of Honor during World War II. We have had people who served in the Korean war, the Vietnam war, and other times of peace, as well as in times of war.
I spent about 23 years, 5 Active, 18 years Ready Reserve as a naval flight officer and much of that as a mission commander of a Navy P-3 aircraft built by Lockheed. We used the P-3 for years for ocean surveillance, tracking submarines during the Cold War so we would know where they were, and whenever we went up, we would know where to go find them and destroy them if we had to. The strategy was called mutually assured destruction. We, fortunately, never had to do that. We used them in the Vietnam war for a lot of coastal surveillance; low- level flights off the coast of Vietnam and Cambodia. The P-3 was introduced into the fleet in 1960s, and it was introduced as a-- formerly used as a commercial airplane, a four-engine turboprop. We had problems with the P-3's wings. We used to say we were afraid they would fall off. I don't know if it was quite that bad, but we had real problems with the P-3s performing reliably as a naval aircraft and bouncing around the skies in all kinds of weather. A lot of work had to be done on the P-3 wing and, within a couple of years, we finally figured out the problem.
They are still flying. We are still using them in Iraq--not to track submarines but all kinds of missions. We have used them for electronic surveillance over the years and we have used them for drug interdiction and now they are doing some special work over in Iraq and that part of the world. It is an airplane which started badly as a military aircraft, but it got a lot better.
You can find the C-5As built in the 1960s, C-5Bs in the 1970s and 1980s--rough startup, rough rampup on the aircraft. We had problems with the aircraft, and we are now overhauling the C-5Bs. We call them C-5Ms. And they are flying 85 percent mission capable. So that is very encouraging. It took a long while to work out the wrinkles, but I think we have now, and we are going to have a plane we will be able to fly for another 30, 40 years, getting a lot of good use out of it, meeting our military needs around the world.
The F-22 has been around for a number of years--not as long as the P- 3, not as long as the C-5, but it has been around for quite a few years. We have, I think, close to maybe 200 of them that either have been built or we are planning to build.
One of the things I find troubling--and I stand in support of the amendment offered by Senators Levin and McCain and ask unanimous consent to be added as a cosponsor of the legislation.
Built, I think, largely by Lockheed, and a lot of the contractual work is being done in maybe close to 40, 45 States. But Lockheed does some great work. This particular aircraft, I am troubled by a number of things, as are the sponsors of the legislation. It is not just that they are troubled, and it is not just that I am troubled, but some other folks are troubled too. Let me see if we have a list of some of the people who are calling and maybe suggesting that the F-22s we have ordered are enough.
Among the people who say, in this case, 187 F-22s, fighter aircraft-- not an aircraft that is used for a lot--a plane mainly built and designed to use for dogfights with aircraft from other nations in an earlier day; the Soviets or maybe the Chinese or some other country. But among the leaders of our country, they are saying, maybe 187 is enough. Not maybe but saying 187 is enough. Two Presidents, former President George Bush and our current President Barack Obama, they have said that not just in giving speeches, but they have actually said that with the budgets they submit to us, and in this case President Obama's first budget and the last budget, or maybe several budgets from President Bush.
Who else has said 187 is enough? Well, Secretaries of Defense; not only the current Secretary of Defense, who is Bob Gates, but the previous Secretary of Defense, who was also Bob Gates, and I think his predecessor as well said 187 should do us.
We have had three Chairs of the Joint Chiefs of Staff who have said 187 F-22s is enough; we think that should do it.
We have had the current members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff who have said 187 is plenty when it comes to F-22 fighter aircraft.
Finally, two of the most respected Members of the Senate, Senators McCain and Levin, as leaders of this committee, have said: Well, this is enough. Given our other demands and our other aircraft we have available to meet this need, 187 F-22s is plenty.
Let me take a look at the next chart, if we could, and see what we have. One of the reasons why all the folks I mentioned have said 187 F- 22s is enough, we think of some of the other aircraft we used, fixed wing as well as nonfixed wing aircraft; the F-15 fighter, a number of hours flown in Iraq and Afghanistan--these are rough numbers but about 40,000 flight hours. We have a couple UAVs here, unmanned aerial vehicles, one called the ScanEagle, the other is called the Predator. The Predator is better known. But so far the ScanEagle has flown in Iraq and Afghanistan about 150 flight hours. The Predator has flown about a half million flight hours in Iraq and Afghanistan. One of our helicopters, I think the H-60, generally we think of as the Black Hawk, but Black Hawks have flown 900,000 flight hours in Iraq and Afghanistan. Down here at the bottom, the number of flight hours, as far as we can tell, flown in Iraq and Afghanistan, I am pretty sure this is correct: Zero for the F-22. That is a stark number, a stark contrast.
Sometimes we tend to order weapons systems, build weapons systems, maintain weapons systems to fight wars such as the last war we fought, not thinking so much about maybe the weapons systems we need for the current war or we will likely to need for a future war. One of the reasons why this administration, the last administration, why this President, this Secretary of Defense and previous ones have said we don't think we want to do any more F-22s is because they believe that, for awhile, we are going to be fighting wars such as unfortunately we fought in Iraq and especially Afghanistan. That is going to be more the modus operandi. We are going to be fighting counterinsurgencies, and what we need are weapons systems and men and women who are trained to fight in those wars. The F-22, frankly, does not lend itself to that kind of war.
I led a congressional delegation with four of my colleagues back at the end of May into Afghanistan and Pakistan, including our Presiding Officer. We learned a lot. It was wonderful, and we came home feeling very much encouraged about our strategy in Afghanistan, the men and women who are implementing that strategy, both on the military and the civilian side. One of the things we learned going into Pakistan is that, for years, the Pakistanis have been preparing to fight the next war not against the Taliban, not against al-Qaida, which happened in the northwestern province, but they have been preparing to fight the next war forever--I guess since 1947--against the Indians, against the country of India. They may have a weapons system to work just fine in that particular altercation if that were to occur. But their real threat, frankly, isn't as much India anymore; their real threat is the Taliban and the al-Qaida folks hanging out in those northwestern provinces on the border of Afghanistan. While India and Pakistan may have plenty of fighter aircraft, unfortunately, they don't have any helicopters. They need mobility and they need helicopters to be able to move their counterinsurgency forces. They don't have them. Frankly, we are sort of guilty in a way of the same thing with the F-22.
Let's see what we have on the next chart. I will come to this in a bit. One of the things we think about when we think of aircraft we use is, first of all, the missions we need the aircraft for and the kind of wars and threats we are likely to face. That helps us make that decision.
Occasionally, we look at how much it costs to fly an aircraft. We look at the dollars we spend to put an aircraft or helicopter into the air for an hour. I have seen a wide range of flight hour costs for the F-22--that it might be $22,000 per flight hour or as high as $40,000 or $42,000 per flight hour. I don't have that at my fingertips, the flight hour costs for other aircraft. But that is a lot of money for a flight hour for any aircraft, especially a fighter aircraft. Whether it is $19,000 or $20,000 or $40,000 an hour, that is a lot of money for the kind of job we are looking for the aircraft to do.
We also look at who are we preparing to fight or what threat we are preparing to counter. Some people say just in case the Chinese ever give us trouble, to take them on we need the F-22s, or we may need 200 more. At one time, General Corley said we needed about another 200. As it turns out, we have other aircraft to meet that kind of threat. I hope that is not going to ever materialize, because China is a major trading partner. I hope we don't ever get in a shooting war with them, nor with the Russians.
We have other fighter aircraft. We have the F-15, F-16, and the F-18. We are in the process of building another new fighter aircraft that will be a joint aircraft that will be able to do fights in the air and other things, including air-to-ground attacks, which the F-22 doesn't lend itself to do. I think we are going to build about 2,500 F-35s. It has broad support. We have built about 50 so far. The cost per aircraft for the F-35 is about $80 million. I think the cost for building a new F-22 is roughly $190 million. So the F-35 may be $80 million a copy, and the F-22, which doesn't have the capability or the viability of the F-35, costs about $190 million--over twice as much. That makes me pause, and I hope it makes some of my colleagues pause as well.
Last, everybody knows we are wrestling through a tough economic time in our country. We have lost a lot of jobs. We had a housing bubble and meltdown, a loss of jobs in banking and financial services, and a lot of manufacturing jobs. Chrysler and GM have gone into bankruptcy. They are coming out of that, and they have a new product line coming through the pipeline. The banks are stabilized and are lending money again, and some are starting to pay back to the government the money they borrowed.
I am bullish about where we are. It will take a while before jobs come back, but I think there are encouraging signs about our economy.
Having said that, a lot of people would like to have a job who don't have one. If we build another 190 or so F-22s, that would save some 25,000 manufacturing, good-paying jobs. We cannot just sniff at that. Those are real numbers, and it is important for us in the States where the jobs are. If we think about it, if we are talking about building another almost 200 F-22s, and they cost roughly $190 million a copy, and we are talking about saving 25,000 jobs, if we multiply $191 million by 194 aircraft, we come up with a total price of about $37 billion for building those extra 194 F-22 aircraft.
If the numbers are correct, that is about $37 billion. If we divide that by 25,000 jobs, that turns out to be almost $1.5 million per job. I nearly fell over when I saw that number--$1.5 million per job. We have passed a stimulus package, and the Presiding Officer and I voted for it. It was passed with bipartisan support, and I hope it will save a couple million jobs. Jobs make sense. But this is a lot of money for jobs.
You can look at what we say we are going to spend in the stimulus package, the recovery bill, per job. I am not quick enough to run the numbers, but these are expensive jobs.
I hope if we don't build another 200 F-22s, some of the folks who can build them at Lockheed Martin--hopefully, some of them will be able to build F-35s. They cost half as much to build, and they do more things. Hopefully, some of them will be bought by other countries. I am not aware that other countries have bought the F-22, but I think a lot would be interested in buying the F-35, given the variety of missions, the versatility, and the much lower cost.
There you have it, Mr. President. I don't know if I have made a compelling case, but I appreciate the chance to share this with my colleagues and anybody else who is interested at a time when we are wrestling with enormous budget deficits, after 8 years where we literally doubled our Nation's debt, and when we are expected to run up the highest budget deficit in the history of our country, at a time when we have major cost overruns and a new weapon system, and when we have had literally two administrations, two Presidents, two Secretaries of State, and all kinds of Joint Chiefs saying: You know, we have a bunch of these F-22s. We have enough. It is not that we are going to stop spending money on national defense. We are going to spend a fair amount of money in Afghanistan, and even though we are drawing down the troops in Iraq, we are going to continue spending money in that country as well. The war in Afghanistan is the right war, and we need to stay with it and crush the Taliban, help the Pakistanis crush al-Qaida, and stay with the folks in Afghanistan until they can help defend themselves and go on to a better economy and a better life. That is the important thing to do.
We don't need the F-22 to do that. To the folks who have spent a number of years, and a lot of our money building it, we say thank you. But I think we have enough. We have plenty of other challenges to face.
I appreciate this opportunity to speak.
As I look around the Chamber, obviously, nobody listened with baited breath to what I had to say. Hopefully, they are in their offices and are tuned into C-SPAN II.
With that, I suggest the absence of a quorum.